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.:R32OC Site Contributor
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm sure this has been talked about previously but it's the source of a massive rant in the office.....

As I'm sure you are all aware, chances are next year you'll be paying about £455 / year for road tax or something like that. One of the main reasons is to have a go at us supposed gas guzzlers. There is no talk about creating the tax versus miles etc.

Right. Just a thought but how about allowing people to offset the amount of CO2 they emit through websites such as carbonneutral. Driving 10,000 miles per year would equate to a £35 charge and you car would be come Carbon Neutral. Job done. I can't imagine the extra £430 million the government will make next year will be spent directly on green issues.

Am I just being silly or does that make sense and I should just shut up?

Here's another point from a money website:

"Just for some more amusement, you might like to try some maths...
My Galaxy V6 will cost £455 to tax and emits 259g/km. If I replaced it (if I could!) with TWO ford focus 1.4's, it would cost £145 less and emit 59g/km more than my Galaxy. I thought I was being reasonably responsible choosing a 7 seater instead of two cars."

What the hell is going on with this "let's jump on the green bandwagon nonsense"? :motz:

Rant over
 

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Its just another tax raising scam in a long line of tax scams from the goverment

Plop a "green" motif on it and its all for the common good.

Even though the uk only produces 2% of the worlds co2,screwing car drivers to save the world is the way forward with the nice little bonus of having a few extra coppers in the coffers
 

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.:R32OC Site Contributor
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Man made global warming is a myth. Tell the folks in your office that if there is such a thing as man-made global warming, why is the earth COOLER this year than last?

Also why during the 40's all the way until the 80's when man had high levels of carbon emissions did the earth progressively get cooler? In the 70's they were so worried that the earth was cooling that we would have an Ice Age?

This global warming b'lox is turning into a religion. Argue back and post the results!
 

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Enigma1992 said:
Man made global warming is a myth.
Global warming is real and man is destroying the ozone layer. The debate is how much change (if any) this is having on our climate. Our fantastic government would have us believe that the reason they tax the [email protected] out of us for driving is becasue they care about the environment. People with half a brain can see through it yet we do nothing (roll on general election).
 

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davefish said:
Global warming is real and man is destroying the ozone layer. The debate is how much change (if any) this is having on our climate.
Man made contribution to global warming - none whatsoever. If you look at any temperature records, the time after most of Europe was on fire (WW2) and the massive global industrial expansion since then, the world was getting cooler. Man's problem is that he thinks he is more important and significant than he actually is. I've a theory that people need things to worry about and this is the new thing to obsess over. The government in the meantime sees it as a way of boosing tax revenue. bah.
 

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if I wear a cardigan listening to the carpenters whilst burning loads of fuel, does this make me carbon neutral. or do i need to stop farting :/
 

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Its a scam man.

If any government gave a toss about the environment then they would have moved away from using petrol cars and fossil fuel power stations decades ago and we'd all be driving electric cars and using renewable energy sources like wind power/wave power/ solar power.

But seeing how they can sell oil/diesel/petrol for lots of money till it runs out and tax the hell out of it they are and making money, screwing us and the environment over as they go proves they aint bothered about the environment.

dont try and make sense of these new tax rules cause they are a load of bollocks!
 

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Okay Global Warming and cooling is a natural process. But the argument is whether or not humans are adding tot he effects.

To say we dont have an effect is just plain silly as it can be clearly shown the the levels of co2 have drasically increased since 1960:



added to the fact that the globe as a whole (not just looking at the uk) has been getting steadily hotter:



clearly shows that since human development and our reliance on machinery and electricity global warming has taken a turn for the warmer. Could this be a natural spike that has happened time and time again over the earths history as can be seen from ice cores, or could it be our effect, who knows???

I can see both sides of the argument in that he government wan us to use more economical cars for (tax reason and filling the chest) as well as acting on what international agreements they have made in the past, and they want to be seen as doing something compared to say the Italian government who have only taken a backward step.

Where as ont he other hand the motorist who purchased there car 2, 3 or even 7 years ago find there is a lot lot larger tax to pay every year find it very unfair.

Now i reckon it is very unfair, and i think yeah if you are now buying a r32 you should have to pay the £440 next year as you know about it at the time of purchase. But us others who purchased the car before the new tax laws came in i dont think should. This would have several benefits in that it would mean the used car market would reboom and used cars would be more sought after with the lower tax levels. Which would also mean that less cars would be destoyed/sent to the scrappies and become usless lumps of metal.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Blimey, thanks for all that! Needless to say people here agree with both sides of the story. I'm inclined to agree with Enigma on the myth thing as I seem to remember reading an article about this in National Geographic saying that there is no doubt that CO2 is damaging in terms of Ozone but there is actually no proof that there is a direct link and that indeed, there is such a thing as Global Warming. Even the scientists disagree.

The only thing that I have seem to have succeeded in doing is have a bunch of women get angry at me for having a big engine and destroying the planet.

Still gutted I have to fork out more money for petrol and road tax. Oh well, just go to lump it and enjoy it while it lasts (and somehow get the women back on side).
 

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mate, didn't post a reply as the whole word 'tax' makes me turn into a raging,babling monster who cannot be controlled - and I thought I would save you all that pain..........

.....I am all for helping the planet etc and I don't even mind paying higher road tax than others (as it is twice the car!) but just sick of how the big man in no.10 keeps piling on the tax and the people it has most impact on are those at the bottom of the economic tree (not suggesting that is me!!). I really sympathise with all our haulers/drivers as they must be buggered at the moment......only positve I can get from this was when we had a mini 'fuel crisis' in Bristol a couple of months back, the only fuel available was V power and nobody wanted it.....

....apart from me!!! Should have seen the other people's faces....not amused.

That is my 2p
 

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ive been told that all the money they make is going to be spent on renewing every road in the uk with rubber so when it rains the rain will bounce up and water all the trees.... apparently this is true???:dancing:
 

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The UK accounts for 2.2% of the World’s C02 emissions (China and the US account for 40%). The UK’s domestic transport sector accounts for 23% of all UK carbon emissions. This means that UK motorists (you and me) contribute 0.5% to the Worlds CO2 emissions. There are 35m UK motorists which I reckon means I contribute 0.000000014% to the Worlds CO2 :star:
 

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pomme said:
Okay Global Warming and cooling is a natural process. But the argument is whether or not humans are adding tot he effects.

To say we dont have an effect is just plain silly as it can be clearly shown the the levels of co2 have drasically increased since 1960:
The two charts you use don't operate over the same time span. The increase in CO2 in chart 1 is only tracked from 1960, whereas temperature is tracked since the late 1800's.

As already said, since the 40's man has seen heavy industrial expansion - massive outputs of the so called pollutants that cause global warming and yet your chart of temperature shows that during that period of time, the temperature has cooled.

Sorry to disagree with you but It doen't show that the earth has become warmer has we have become more dependant on machinery and electricity at all - quite the opposite. At the time when we were outputting greenhouse gases with impunity, the earth was getting cooler. Likewise when we were bombing the heck out of Germany and Japan and vica versa, the earth was cooling. If the global warming arguement held any water, the temperature chart should show a direct corrolation but it shows the opposite.

http://www.onenewsnow.com/Politics/Default.aspx?id=68277

The above article quotes Marc Morano in February 2008 (who is a resident authority on global warming with the U.S. Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works minority staff)

Solar scientists are worried about the lows," he says. "They're calling it the 'disturbingly quiet solar cycle.' And we're faced with again just a lack of years ... of temperatures just sort of 'plateau-ing out' to the point where the head of the U.N. IPCC [Inter-Governmental Panel on Climate Change] has recently called for an investigation as to why temperatures were not continuing to rise as predicted."

Morano also notes that between 1940 and 1975, the earth's temperature cooled even though CO2 levels rose. And global warming alarmists, he notes, have failed to explain the lack of a correlation between rising CO2 and rising temperatures, a theory that Al Gore promotes in his movie An Inconvenient Truth."
Totally agree here though:

pomme said:
Where as ont he other hand the motorist who purchased there car 2, 3 or even 7 years ago find there is a lot lot larger tax to pay every year find it very unfair.

Now i reckon it is very unfair, and i think yeah if you are now buying a r32 you should have to pay the £440 next year as you know about it at the time of purchase. But us others who purchased the car before the new tax laws came in i dont think should. This would have several benefits in that it would mean the used car market would reboom and used cars would be more sought after with the lower tax levels. Which would also mean that less cars would be destoyed/sent to the scrappies and become usless lumps of metal.
I don't think we've heard the last of the rebellion against retrospective VED - it was continues to be brought up as the present government's stealth tax policy against the already hard pressed working families. Day before yesterday by David Cameron on R4, today at PMQ's.
 

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davefish said:
The UK accounts for 2.2% of the World's C02 emissions (China and the US account for 40%). The UK's domestic transport sector accounts for 23% of all UK carbon emissions. This means that UK motorists (you and me) contribute 0.5% to the Worlds CO2 emissions. There are 35m UK motorists which I reckon means I contribute 0.000000014% to the Worlds CO2 :star:
Dave, I'm sure you've rolled that one out before?!?! lol! Good stats though!

If the scientists disagree then there's obviously some cloudy areas open for debate. What is clear however, is that as a country, the UK motorist has a minimal impact on global CO2 emissions compared to nations like China, India, USA etc. So why do we get bent over and shafted with endless green taxes on what feels like a monthly basis?

It's blatantly government one-up-manship for old Gordo to head off to the G8, or whatever shindig is on at the time, and proclaim his steps in reducing the UK's carbon production. The sad truth of the matter is that the UK isn't as important as it once was and all these green initiatives, programmes, taxes etc are to make our government look like a leader on green issues; when the reality is that the UK is miles behind.

:marchmellow:
 

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sdmac27 said:
Dave, I'm sure you've rolled that one out before?!?! lol! Good stats though!
Yeah this is the third time lol. It took me 30 mins to collect the data and do the calculation so I want to get my moneys worth out of it!

sdmac27 said:
So why do we get bent over and shafted with endless green taxes on what feels like a monthly basis? It's blatantly government one-up-manship for old Gordo to head off to the G8, or whatever shindig is on at the time, and proclaim his steps in reducing the UK's carbon production.
Either that or finding ways to recover the MASSIVE amount of money wasted on the war, public transport and healthcare. Most of which are Tony's fault.
 

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Enigma1992 said:
Sorry to disagree with you but It doen't show that the earth has become warmer has we have become more dependant on machinery and electricity at all - quite the opposite.

The planet is warming, not cooling FACT. From 1920 onwards, the internal combustion engine, jet engine and coal factories came into operation. Are they the cause? My guess is they haven't helped but probably not nearly as much as some people think. Scientists can't argree so we've got no chance ;-)
 

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Yeah, temp still dips after 1940 while co2 rises, and continues to do so at least until the mid 50's according to the graph. CO2 seems to follow temperature, not the other way around.

Planet temp is fluctuating, this year it's cooler. So much for projections from people who think the end of the world is nigh. They can't even tell me what the temperature is likely to be at the weekend with any accuracy never mind the temperature in 20 years time. :)
 

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Enigma1992 said:
Yeah, temp still dips after 1940 while co2 rises, and continues to do so at least until the mid 50's according to the graph. CO2 seems to follow temperature, not the other way around.
You need to look at the overall picture, not just focus on a dip in 1950. I will concede that this is a strange anomaly but it doesn't change the fact that there's a very obvious trend. How do you deduce that CO2 is following temperature? How does an increase in Earth's temperature create more CO2?

Ps. Enjoying this thread ;-)
 
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