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MK5 Prop shaft/bearing gone bang.


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#1
South Hams Gaz

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Gave it full beans out of a blind turning today and there was a sudden banging from under the shifter.

 

Dropped the clutch and it stopped, but when I put it back in gear and got above 40mph it returned.

 

Stopped the car for a few minutes to have a quick google, then carried on assuming the centre bearing had gone. Was able to get up to speeds of about 50mph and didn't get any banging, but there was a slight vibration the faster I went. 

 

I am assuming the centre bearing has gone? So was going to order a replacement, such as Meyle  https://www.ebay.co....l0AAOSwfr1bwNMy

 

or more likely this.

 

https://progressivep...-volkswagen-r32

 

Do you think it is just the bearing from my description, and how big a job is this?

 

I know the exhaust and the heat shields will need to be removed, what about subframe?


Edited by South Hams Gaz, 13 May 2020 - 05:14 PM.


#2
buyers remorse

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Does the banging sound like someone tapping on a length of scaffolding pole? Can you see any thrown grease showing past the heatshields?

 

When mine went, I thought (hoped) it was the centre support bearing.

 

But once the exhaust and heat shields came off, it turned out the joint was shot. The boot had split and thrown all the grease, leading to its untimely demise.

 

You can split the Mk5 propshaft, but it isn't designed to be split like the Mk4. At least the later ones aren't, IIRC the earlier Mk5 are.

 

I ended up buying a used propshaft (an earlier version that was bolted together) and replacing the giubos and the 034 centre support bearing.

 

The original one looked like this (not designed to be split):

 

Attached File  nosplit.png   92.62KB   1 downloads

 

 

 

The one I replaced it with looked like this (bolt together):

 

 

Attached File  Split.png   69.96KB   1 downloads


Edited by buyers remorse, 13 May 2020 - 10:28 PM.


#3
South Hams Gaz

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Just had a look and there was no grease. Will get the car back out on the ramps tomorrow to see which kind of shaft coupling I have, it is a 56 plate. 

It sounds like the noise you would expect if the coupling was banging  on the transmission tunnel. 

I read that the A3 3.2 shaft fits, what about that from the mk2 TT 3.2, will they fit as there are a few on ebay should I need one.



#4
buyers remorse

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Don't quote me on this, but I think the TT shafts are shorter.

 

I'm not sure if he is still about, but try Daly Singh on Facebook. He had a few propshafts when I bought mine from him.

 

FWIW, you can split the Mk5 propshaft, even though it isn't bolted together. If I only needed to swap out the bearing that is what I would have done. But with the joint being shot, there was no point.



#5
South Hams Gaz

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Found one advertised at £100, like the one you bought with bolts. How much were they from D.S.?

The more I think about it the more I think the coupling is FUBAR. The centre bearing still appeared to be attached to the shaft, even though it had a fair bit of movement in the rubber, it was all still there.

And given it went at full bore 1st to 2nd gear acceleration on hard lock makes me think the coupling just gave up.


Edited by South Hams Gaz, 13 May 2020 - 09:09 PM.


#6
buyers remorse

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For me, there was no flail that would suggest the centre bearing was gone. But I had forwards/backwards play, with an unpleasant clonk.

 

I paid either £70 or £90 collected.

 

Thinking back... I think it works like this:

  • Mk4 prop shafts - bolt together - not compatible with Mk5 because of a different haldex coupling
  • early Mk5 prop shaft - bolt together - is compatible (and is what I replaced with)
  • late Mk5 prop shaft - sealed unit (what I had, and couldn't find a decent replacement)

You'll probably want to check you're getting an early Mk5 shaft, rather than a Mk4... 



#7
South Hams Gaz

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Thanks for the info.

 

Just collecting a list of all the bits I am going to need.

New subframe bolts ordered.

The 3 bolts that connect the shaft to the 'box and diff, are they the same both ends? I think the part number for the 'box end is N90846102?

Don't suppose you have a list or link to torque values for everything?

 

Cheers.



#8
buyers remorse

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Have you definitely confirmed its fubarred?

 

IIRC, the bolts are different lengths. the ones to the rear diff are longer.

 

I know there was definitely some changeover on the Mk5 with the propshaft, so you'll want to double check where yours sits. Mine is a very late model MkV.

 

For part numbers, I normally use http://www.oemepc.com. It's under cardanshaft in the rear axle section.

 

If stuff has been superseded, I normally check the ecs website for new part numbers https://www.ecstunin...in/Driveshafts/

 

I've always used the torque specs from ECS's subframe locking collar guide, and googled the rest. 

 

Attached File  PDF_7343_MK5_MK6_Subframe_Locking_Collar_Kit.pdf   1.7MB   1 downloads


Edited by buyers remorse, 14 May 2020 - 09:59 AM.


#9
South Hams Gaz

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Perfect, thanks.

 

I am not 100%, but given it needs to come off to be properly checked, and it is my only means of transport, I may as well spend £100 on a used shaft, get it stripped and replace the main bearing and have it ready to go for when all my parts arrive, to minimise the time it is off the road. If it turns out the shaft is Ok I can sell it on to minimise costs.

 

Decided to replace the control arm bushes with Meyle HD whilst at it, at least there is going to be a slight upgrade as a result of all this faf.


Edited by South Hams Gaz, 14 May 2020 - 10:07 AM.


#10
South Hams Gaz

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Dam it. The one I saw advertised is sold and Daly has sold all of his too.

Anyone got one kicking around? lol.gif



#11
buyers remorse

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Sorry mate, can't help you with that one sad.png

 

Going back to the torque specs, and a little off topic, if I'm really struggling to find one I sometimes end up with this Audi guide

 

Attached File  10-audi_a3_qsb_web.pdf   5.74MB   4 downloads



#12
South Hams Gaz

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Just got under for another look at what was going to be required for strip down and it was visible today that one of the 3 bolts holding the guibo to the 'box was missing. Doh.

 

Hopefully replacing that sort it.


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#13
cuprabob

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Just got under for another look at what was going to be required for strip down and it was visible today that one of the 3 bolts holding the guibo to the 'box was missing. Doh.

Hopefully replacing that sort it.

Just be careful as on the centre coupling it can look as though there is bolt(s) missing but they are used to balance the propshaft assembly.

Although from your description it sounds as though you are talking about a different area, a guide as opposed to a coupling. Just making you aware incase you notice while looking in that area.

Edited by cuprabob, 14 May 2020 - 11:43 AM.

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#14
ScubaPaul

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The propshaft was changed in 2007, anything made after week 27 in 2007 was the non-servicable  propshaft.

 

Pictures and torque settings here:

 

Before July 2007, servicable propshaft

 

http://r32.online/wp...7-1536x1128.png

 

After July 2007

 

http://r32.online/wp...n-1536x1089.png


Edited by ScubaPaul, 14 May 2020 - 11:42 AM.

DPB DSG MK5 R32


#15
South Hams Gaz

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Yeah, I am talking about where the prop attaches to the gearbox.

 

Had a better poke around and the bolt is snapped half way through the bush. So I am not convinced that is the problem, just a coincidence.  Won't find out till it is all apart, by which point I am without transport until I can source a prop shaft if needed. AAARRGGHHH.



#16
buyers remorse

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Thanks scubapaul for confirming the dates.

 

They are definitely interchangeable, I've been running the "wrong" one for 18 months now.



#17
buyers remorse

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Yeah, I am talking about where the prop attaches to the gearbox.

 

Had a better poke around and the bolt is snapped half way through the bush. So I am not convinced that is the problem, just a coincidence.  Won't find out till it is all apart, by which point I am without transport until I can source a prop shaft if needed. AAARRGGHHH.

 

So if you grab hold of the shaft, is there any lateral or vertical movement? (if so, I'd guess the support bearing)

 

And if you pull/push the shaft, do you get any distinct knocks? (if so, I'd guess the coupling, like mine)

 

Is it possible it spat the head of the sheared bolt in the front giubo and you heard it banging off the tunnel?


Edited by buyers remorse, 14 May 2020 - 12:49 PM.


#18
South Hams Gaz

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Grabbing the shaft gearbox side of the centre bearing and there is very little play.

 

Grab it from the other side and there is some up down movement, so looks like it is the coupling that is gone.

 

The banging is defo the whole coupling moving around, took it out again last night just to check, after bolting the bearing back to the chassis, having had a look at it, and it was still doing it above 40 if accelerating.


Edited by South Hams Gaz, 14 May 2020 - 01:02 PM.


#19
South Hams Gaz

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Thanks for all the help guys. 

 

Found the part numbers I need for the bolts front and rear.

Just need to source a used shaft now.



#20
buyers remorse

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Good luck mate, I hope you find one quickly.

 

If you want to laugh/cry, give VW a call to see how much they want to charge you for a new one blink.png  

 

I thought I was the only guy to have one of these shafts fail with the support bearing still OK cray.gif

All the other cases I read about were precipitated by the support bearing failing first.

 

I'll be interested to hear what yours is like when you get it out.



#21
South Hams Gaz

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Turns out i was a bit hasty in my diagnosis.

I wasn't 100%, and was struggling to find a spare prop, so got my go pro style camera and bodged it into the engine bay. I then cable tied in my workshop light and took the car out for a drive.

It was immediately clear the issue was in fact the snapped bolt, allowing the guibo bush where the prop meets the gearbox to bounce around.

Still going to have to drop the subframe so i can remove the snapped bolt which is annoying, but a whole heap less pain than having to replace the prop.

#22
buyers remorse

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That's great news mate good.gif

 

If you're going to replace the giubo, I've been using the febi one and I've had no issues so far.



#23
South Hams Gaz

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That's great news mate good.gif

 

If you're going to replace the giubo, I've been using the febi one and I've had no issues so far.

 

 

 

Probably a good idea, bet mine is a bit buggered now.

 

This look the same as the one you bought?

 

https://www.ebay.co....coAAOSwqG5dN0yA


Edited by South Hams Gaz, 15 May 2020 - 07:34 PM.


#24
buyers remorse

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Because I had ordered some other stuff at the same time, I got this one from ECS:

 

https://www.ecstunin...1j0521127a~feb/



#25
South Hams Gaz

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Anyone know what torque the bolts holding the Giubo to the shaft and Giubo to the gearbox need to be, can't find anything online?



#26
ScubaPaul

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My post above has the torque vales for both the earlier and later types


DPB DSG MK5 R32


#27
ScubaPaul

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Anyone know what torque the bolts holding the Giubo to the shaft and Giubo to the gearbox need to be, can't find anything online?

 

My post above has the torque values for both the earlier and later types


Edited by ScubaPaul, 21 May 2020 - 09:39 PM.

DPB DSG MK5 R32


#28
South Hams Gaz

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My post above has the torque vales for both the earlier and later types

So it does, thank you.



#29
South Hams Gaz

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Looks like i need a new prop shaft after all, didn't know there was a locating part in the middle. 

 

VtsRDAS.jpg?1



#30
South Hams Gaz

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Going to need to remove the 3 point bracket from the box to get the broken bolt out.

Is it just a case of remove the 36mm nut and it slides off?

 

mPD6jZb.jpg?1






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